Rahm Emanuel has been a fixture in Democratic Party politics for more than 30 years — serving as a member of Congress, President Obama's chief of staff, mayor of Chicago and ambassador to Japan.
He is now exploring a campaign for the presidency, an effort that seems designed to challenge some orthodoxies of that same party. He has argued that Democrats have the wrong focus on social issues, education and the economy. Appearing on a podcast with the conservative host Megyn Kelly, he answered a question about transgender people in a way she praised, and then he joked that he would need "witness protection."
Emanuel joined me for an extended NPR video interview in Washington, D.C., during which he expanded on his critique of Democrats, hammered the Trump administration and offered advice for the upcoming midterm elections that will decide control of Congress.
You can watch the full video interview above. Below are highlights:
He says the U.S. is throwing away global alliances
We spoke just after Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney delivered a much-noticed speech at the World Economic Forum, saying that the U.S.-led, rules-based world order was over, a "fiction" that other nations should abandon now that the U.S. itself no longer respects it. Carney was responding to President Trump, who had used a series of threats in a bid to take control of Greenland.
"Carney's not wrong," Emanuel said. "We just decided that it's a burden on us, and we're going to see the price for that. And that price will be more than the American people, in a host of issues–economic, political, strategic, defense-wise–than the American people are ready to bear alone."
He says the Trump administration betrays the idea of America held by Emanuel's family
He surely has told the story before, but Emanuel seemed genuinely moved while talking of photographs on his family's living room wall growing up. They showed 14 ancestors, "28 eyes," many of whom perished in European pogroms or the Holocaust. "We knew growing up that America was a very special place," he said.
He said that idea of the country completely clashes with the spectacle of immigration agents flooding Minneapolis in recent weeks.
"The idea that you have ICE agents chasing people, firing tear gas… The president attacking people on both religion, gender or faith… That is unimaginable," he said.
He says local governments should cooperate with ICE — in very limited cases
We had a lengthy exchange over whether local officials should collaborate with Immigration and Customs Enforcement, even when they disagree with the mission. Tom Homan, President Trump's border czar, has said he wished Minneapolis would allow agents to arrest people without legal status who are held on unrelated offenses in local jails. Democratic officials have, in past administrations, asked for the same.
Emanuel said he would favor this for people in prison, "one hundred percent," because people in prison have been convicted of crimes. He felt differently about jails, because "I'm not sure what they're charged with."
He says both parties have failed students
Emanuel recently visited Mississippi, a conservative state that has dramatically improved student reading skills. He argued that success could be replicated elsewhere, if not for partisan politics.
"Republicans have walked away from public education, abandoned it," he said. "Democrats have abandoned accountability and standards."
He wants Democrats to spend more time on pocketbook issues
He argues Democrats spent too much time on social justice issues they couldn't win, such as transgender rights.
On Megyn Kelly's podcast, he was asked: "Can a man become a woman?" His answer was, "No."
The remark seemed to go beyond debates about transgender children or trans athletes, rejecting the idea that transgender people exist at all.
Asked about this on NPR, Emanuel replied, "That's not what I said." Here is the video of that exchange with him and Kelly.
In our interview, he explained what he wanted to convey – that the issue was a distraction. As mayor in 2016, he said, "I passed an ordinance on bathroom access, but I never allowed it to distract me from high school graduation rates, reading scores and math scores."
"If I run and the issues on trans are the most important, I'm not your guy and I'm OK with that," he said.
He says there is one issue in the 2026 election
Emanuel urged Democrats to focus on Trump, who is unpopular, and the failure of other Republicans to restrain him in any way.
"This is a referendum election. Keep it focused on the rubber stamp Republican Congress," Emanuel said. "You have to win independents 2 to 1 to win the House. They are uncomfortable with Donald Trump and they're uncomfortable that nobody from the Roberts court, to the press and media, to the Republican Congress are putting a checkmate on him."
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